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Click The above is licensed under 2.0. Fantasy Flight Games recently did a reprint of the core box for Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay Third Edition, meaning it can finally be purchased for MSRP or less after being rare and out of print for years. I've seen WFRP get a lot of hate thrown its way, and I'd like to encourage more people to give it a chance, especially now that you can buy the core set again. First off, you have to accept that WFRP3 is a game that uses a bunch of components.
Lots of people have compared it to a board game, or get stuck on the game's lack of availability in PDF. There are rules (including a PDF) put out by FFG to play WFRP3 and its first couple of expansions without any of the components other than the special dice. In my opinion, using those rules is pure cowardice, and I'd refer you to the sales charts for this game showing that sales of WFRP3 started going down immediately after they re-released the game with a component-less alternative. Buy the physical sets that include a bunch of bits. Love the bits. Live the bits. Have fun coming up with ways to store the bits (seriously, this is one of the unsung joys of owning board games).
Marvel at how all the bits cover your table in a kaleidoscope of colors and information. Just look at all this stuff! If this doesn't sing to the inner child within you, I'd recommend you round up an adventuring party to go find where it was kidnapped to.
EDIT: In the picture above, they are using maps and plastic miniatures not actually included in WFRP3. WFRP3 does NOT require use of a map and uses abstracted range bands mostly identical to those used in FFG Star Wars. WFRP3 does include a bunch of cardboard standups you can use if you desire, but they are completey optional. Combat can be done completely in theatre of the mind. There are three main things that having all of these bits allows for. First, the bits take all of the information that would otherwise be stored in the rulebook and put it all out on the table in easily accessible chunks.
No longer will you be turning to page 367 because Steve cast the 'Fish!' Blessing (yes this a real spell in the game and yes it produces a fish out of thin air on command) because all he has to do is play the card and all the rules are right there.
Second, the components allow you to ignore the issues of erasing and writing and re-erasing and re-writing all the little piddly things you track in most RPGs. Even Apocalypse World has a health track that you have to write and erase in (eat it, minimalist game design!). These bits don't only allow you track numbered things like wound counts and the like. You can also have special cards to give players when they catch a disease, gain a mutation, or even get a temporary condition (you don't have to try writing down all the rules for Steve being drunk on Fish Ale because he just has a card in front of him for the Drunk condition!). You also get these cool progress trackers that the game gives you all kinds of ideas on using for tracking things during encounters.
You know those nifty threat clocks Mr. Harper has in Blades in the Dark? Meet their progenitor! Finally, the bits allow you to add complexity and depth to combat that would be impossible with other games. Players each build a personal deck of action cards that they can use in battle, and astute players will note that there are endless combos they can build up both with their own character and with each other. All of these special powers are easily accessible to players and work in conjunction with the special dice to have all kinds of cool outcomes and special effects that would be too much to remember (or write down/print) in other game systems.
Speaking of the special dice, I suppose I should mention them for folks unfamiliar with them. Now, I've heard a lot of people online say that they hate the idea of proprietary dice and that they'd never buy weird dice only usable for a single game. Aside from questioning the idea of fellow nerds being concerned about wasting their money (kickstarter, anyone?), all I can say is that the dice are worth the investment. Any time someone starts to complain about these dice, the same old bunch of complaints come up.
'These dice can only be used for a single game!' 'RPG nerds frequently buy dozens of sets of dice they'll likely never use.' 'The dice are way too expensive!' 'You can use an online dice roller for free.' 'I need my tactile dice feel!' 'Then buy a single set and it will do well' 'Every player has to have a full set of dice at all times or it will take too long!'
'The game was designed for people to use a communal dice pool.' And on and on. Anyway, dice phobia aside, these dice work similarly to the ones in Edge of the Empire. You have three main sets of results (success/failure, advantage/disadvantage, critical success/critical failure), as well as few special results scattered in. The big difference between WFRP dice and Star Wars dice is that WFRP introduces a mechanic of how Reckless/Conservative your character is leading them to upgrade their normal dice to these special dice. Conservative dice are more likely to succeed, but might delay the character in doing so, while reckless dice will succeed big when they succeed, but might hurt the character directly. There are some kinks in WFRP's dice math and how big dice pools get at advanced levels of the game, but it's still serviceable and really fun.
Honestly, the star wars dice feel sterile in some ways compared to the less symmetrical WFRP dice. Finally, I'll briefly go over why the WFRP setting is actually super awesome. Long time WFRP players already know this, but for those of you who don't, WFRP is basically a grim and gritty medieval fantasy world painted in bright cartoony neon.
WFRP is a game that has a sense of humor about how grim it is. Yes, Steve can get rotleg and limp around for weeks, but he can also get a bad case of gas leading him to take social penalties. WFRP assumes a play style that I think is how most people actually play RPGs. It's all about the GM doing over the top stuff to the player characters who in turn come up with over the top schemes to defuse it. The WFRP setting is one that is actually meant for wild player behavior to happen. Ever noticed how some of the most memorable Call of Cthulhu sessions were ones where a doctor specialized in headbutt and headbutted all the skeletons to death? WFRP as a setting encourages that kind of thing.
Found a cult in the heart of the temple? Bribe the guards, murder the inhabitants, then burn down the building for good measure. Something really important in the core book is its talk about the economy. WFRP is a setting of class stratification, with dirt poor, middle class, and ultra wealthy. The book calls out the fact that as adventurers, the players are meant to blur the lines between these classes, and interact with them all. In addition, the book flat out says that the reason players turn to adventuring is to make money. Instant motivation, and one that keeps in with typical player behavior.
Go in, blow stuff up, get paid. You're not going to find another fantasy setting that so accurately captures the sense of humor in roleplaying.
So I encourage everyone to go out and give this wonderful system a shot. You can buy most of it for super cheap (if this thread gets much interest, I'll post up my recommended purchases). Who has tried the system out and enjoyed it? I know I've left out a lot of features, but that's because it's really the biggest advantage and disadvantage of WFRP3: it's so full of cool features and ideas that you forget to use them all! I started WFRP with the 2nd edition. IMO that was great. The 3rd felt like a huge downgrade when it came out.
I'm fine with the dice. Special dice are cool thing. We use them in Star Wars and that system is great (as well). But the rest is meh! Most of my players focus on the roleplay. They want to do cool stuff or play out ca character. There is no way I could explain them: 'You can't do this, because you have not card that allows you to do so.'
I'd get lynched for that. And I don't want a board or miniaturs either. Most of our WFRP campaigns were spread through a wide area. When the group wants to go somewhere I don't want to say: 'Could you please go somewhere else where we have more minis for?'
With the 2nd edition I as the GM was the only one that needed book. About 6 of them. Read all the stuff we want to have and tell my players what they need on their char sheet.
The rest could be done all in our heads. That worked great. With 3rd it feels more like: We want to go somewhere else or do something new, thus we need to buy more stuff, do play cool stuff, instead of beeing able to creat cool stuff on our own.
We also gave Star Wars EotE a shot as well, but was met with the same results as WFRP3. In a nutshell, we didn't like the custom dice and mechanics of that either - and I really wanted to like that one, been itching for a new Star Wars game for a long time. But ultimately, it's just not something we enjoyed. Edit: It's my hope that for WFRP4, if they ever make it, that they return to the roots. A game written in the grim and gritty style of 1st edition, but with 2nd edition mechanics. The only thing about 2nd I'd like changed is the severity of insanities, they're pretty brutal in that version.
I'd prefer they used the wide spectrum of 1st edition - they're a lot more 'normal' in terms of insanities, such as phobias to people and things, eating disorders, etc. We didn't like how the dice resolutions determined narrative things when the situation didn't really call for it. My players liked playing with their own colorful dice that they purchased at the store (They're long time RPers, they have their 'lucky' dice that they like using). We didn't like how combat worked out, it just felt off. Basically, we just didn't like the system in general. Edit: I should note that it's been 3 years or so since we've played it What I'd love, is a Star Wars system using modified WFRP2 rules, oh gawd.
I'd play that forever. Using the Force could be similar as casting spells, and it would work spectacularly. Deflecting laser blasts with a lightsaber? That'd be just a normal parrying vs ballistics (something you can't really do in 2nd edition - unless I guess if you're a vampire with the Quickblood trait). A wide spectrum of Star Wars careers, ranging from Moisture Farmers, Smugglers, Cantina Owners, all the way to Legendary Bounty Hunters and Jedi Masters.
It'd be beautiful! The nice thing with the dice is that you are given results you can always use in lieu of narrative ones if you can't think of anything else (gain/loss stress/fatigue), and in WFRP3 you can also make use of other mechanics, such as applying conditions or diseases or other things to characters. Again, if the dice resolution didn't have much narrative impact, why'd it get rolled in the first place? As far as playing moisture farmers, cantina owners, and the like, FFG Star Wars just combined all of those into a single career (colonist) and is better for it. Star Wars isn't a setting like WFRP about common people against uncommon things. It's about a hero's journey and people leaving their humble beginnings behind to do something completely different. I could argue that we just didn't ultimately like the mechanics of WFRP3 and EotE.
Some people like apples, some people like oranges. But I get it though, some people do like that type of system - it just wasn't for us. For the narrative dice, I don't like dice that tell me to narrate something, even if there are workarounds and alternatives to do other things when that pops up. To me, Star Wars encompasses everything from the lowly moister farmer all the way up to the leader of the Galaxy. It'd be exciting to start as a scavenger or moisture farmer on some hostile remote world, working your way up through mercenary, smuggler, or whatever route you weave in and out of while advancing, and ultimately reach bounty hunter or Jedi Master, or whatever your goal is.
There's a lot of good RP in that during the journey, just like there can be in WFRP 1st/2nd edition due to all the many careers and possibilities. I don't really think this is the case. The biggest limiting factor of WFRP is extra careers. You need to buy expansions to play as certain careers. That sucks, but the expansions are all super cheap now, so it's not THAT big of a deal. Also, fans have made a resource allowing you to create and print out your own cards, so you can make up new stuff of make proxies if you want.
When it comes to the minis, you proxy them out the same way you would in D&D if your players fought a bugbear and you only had goblin minis. This seems like common sense to me and a fake complaint. The minis aren't required.
The nice thing about this system is that many of its rules are modular and can be added or removed. Also, your players can absolutely do anything they want, even if they don't have the card for it. There's an action card called Perform a Stunt that lets you do anything you can imagine. It won't allow you to replicate another action card (and in fact this encourages players to be creative rather than try power gaming for extra damage), but it lets you do all kinds of cool actions you can think up.
If you want to go somewhere else or do something new you can totally do it in wfrp3. The components aren't required for any of that. When it comes to the minis, you proxy them out the same way you would in D&D if your players fought a bugbear and you only had goblin minis.
This seems like common sense to me and a fake complaint. And that's why I don't play D&D (and alike) with minis. Why play with minis, if you usually have to proxy them anyway? You arguments sound solid. But they just say 'you can still do the same'. But I still don't see any reason to start with 3rd, as for me there seems nothing to gain from it.
Other probably enjoy it, but to me it feels like 2nd allready has everything I want from WFRP. Thanks for posting this. I was looking for some video reviews and at other sites for a gauge on this system before I dropped the cash. I'm thrilled I held off this long and they rereleased it, that should make the decision easier. Again, thanks for the content, this sounds like something right up my groups alley. Edit I'd love to see your recommendations for buying in, we're up for a rotation in GM/system soon in our group, and I'm really interested in giving this a shot.
We've played the Star Wars system so the mechanics shouldn't be too foreign for us.
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